Affliction Warlock Feedback for June 5th – Level 15 and 90 Talent Rows



Comment by omedon666

on 2018-06-05T17:13:48-05:00

…”to satisfy a different desire (as players mentioned even in this thread) to allow Drain Soul and Grimoire of Sacrifice to be taken together, as both are identity, feel, and greatly gameplay changing.”

A desire I had so hard and am so happy they facilitated! I like being petless for group content (and letting that talent tier “go dead” while soloing with a void lord is fine and hurts no one), and drain soul is a must have aesthetically and conceptually!

Comment by dingledots

on 2018-06-05T17:26:26-05:00

I just don’t understand the obsession with bringing back an ability that does nothing and has no gameplay with anything else in the spec. (shadowbolt). mastery over dots and drains spends the majority of the rotation ST spamming a bolt. Sacrificing class fantasy and mobile dps for some nostalgia is just plain bad class design. I appreciate the steps being taken to make builds more interesting but this just seems like putting a band aid on a gaping wound that was only opened because we’re fixing something that isn’t broken. Should’ve just kept legion build with the haunt changes, new cds, and deathbolt IMO.

Comment by Kekt0nic

on 2018-06-05T17:36:54-05:00

I just don’t understand the obsession with bringing back an ability that does nothing and has no gameplay with anything else in the spec. (shadowbolt). mastery over dots and drains spends the majority of the rotation ST spamming a bolt. Sacrificing class fantasy and mobile dps for some nostalgia is just plain bad class design. I appreciate the steps being taken to make builds more interesting but this just seems like putting a band aid on a gaping wound that was only opened because we’re fixing something that isn’t broken. Should’ve just kept legion build with the haunt changes, new cds, and deathbolt IMO.

“class fantasy” is such an empty phrase that needs to be flushed down the drain with every other bad meme in existence

Comment by dingledots

on 2018-06-05T17:39:01-05:00

except its core to class design? lol making a spec fun to play and make sense and be balanced. make sense (class design). aff shouldnt be pulled away from a spec that dots and drains. currently on beta unless youre taking 1 talent youre never draining unless youre dieing.

Comment by Mike21daisu

on 2018-06-05T17:46:29-05:00

Everyone is gonna take Drain Soul, still. But I guess it’s cool to add Shadow Bolt back for people that appreciate class fantasy more than the damage they deal. It made more sense (or just sense) back in the day, now it doesn’t. If you want shadow bolt to make more sense now you gotta change the spec a bit. Nowadays the specs are mastery focused. What I mean by that is that if your spec is hot focused (druid), you won’t use straight heals (healing touch/swiftmend) a lot, if at all… Example is the majority of the druids’ build in antorus right now, and the abilities that they use. If you understand all of this, that is how much sense Shadow bolt makes in the current afflication warlock’s spec. It’s like adding meat to an ice-cream, ’cause you love meat. Nothing is wrong with either of them, they don’t go well together (Shadow bolt & current affliction spec), but I like them both.

Comment by dingledots

on 2018-06-05T17:57:08-05:00

Also not the only reason I was saying shadow bolt is bad. I wouldn’t mind compromising and having shadow bolt as a talent but drain should be the baseline filler. With shadow bolt as a filler you’re just a turret spamming a hard cast that doesn’t correlate with your dots or pets. Not excited about the best ST build turning into an immobile boring hard cast spam that doesn’t do anything interesting. Excited about deathbolt, it seems fun and engaging as long as it works out. Also excited about deathglare and how it works. I just wish shadow bolt was the talent and drain soul was baseline as filler. The reasons are pretty clear and I know multiple people on beta have expressed this. If you want shadow bolt go main demo and have your 1 dot and your pets and your bolt spam.

Comment by dingledots

on 2018-06-05T18:07:10-05:00

This is all assuming balancing is done correctly. Honestly I wouldn’t mind if the shadow bolt builds are garbo and stay that way all expac. I mean that way the people who want to play it can play it for fun and the people who are doing high end content will never have to touch it. But that’s not how things should be done. Also with this iteration you can’t take deathbolt+DS. so you cant even use the more fluid better filler with the fun new bolt that actually does interact with your dots. The silver lining is that I’ll be running high keys 90% of the time and DS will be the go to as long as the shard sniping remains. I’m just not looking forward to pvp and raiding on the side to be even more boring then they were in legion for aff.

Comment by Sydbarrett81

on 2018-06-05T18:48:48-05:00

I main a lock and affliction is too easy to play, there is negligible penalty for moving which is what raises the skill cap for any casting class. I completely understand why they are adding a filler that penalizes you for moving it puts it in line with other casters in my opinion.

Comment by Albaharmamar

on 2018-06-05T19:50:10-05:00

guess my affliction warlock will be collecting dust for a while :/

Comment by Candris

on 2018-06-05T21:50:02-05:00

This new affliction warlock is horrible. The DOT style in Legion was fine now they want 2 retard bolts as fillers and please do something with grimoire of sacrifice it’s just uselesss.

Comment by Ravendarke

on 2018-06-05T22:03:20-05:00

I main a lock and affliction is too easy to play, there is negligible penalty for moving which is what raises the skill cap for any casting class. I completely understand why they are adding a filler that penalizes you for moving it puts it in line with other casters in my opinion.

Then you are playing it ridiculously wrong… since our dps ST lose is heavy while moving with ideal build. Seems you have lazy build which is FAR from optimal, but that’s your choice, stop ruining affli for others.

Comment by Sydbarrett81

on 2018-06-06T00:00:28-05:00

Im not running a lazy ST build at all, im just saying if you move say 2/3 through that cast of a chaos bolt for example or you clip the last 0.2 sec of drain soul, due to mechanics, who loses more dps, sorry but its a fact that with less penalty fro a channelled spell

Comment by precise

on 2018-06-06T04:01:49-05:00

I just don’t understand the obsession with bringing back an ability that does nothing and has no gameplay with anything else in the spec. (shadowbolt). mastery over dots and drains spends the majority of the rotation ST spamming a bolt. Sacrificing class fantasy and mobile dps for some nostalgia is just plain bad class design. I appreciate the steps being taken to make builds more interesting but this just seems like putting a band aid on a gaping wound that was only opened because we’re fixing something that isn’t broken. Should’ve just kept legion build with the haunt changes, new cds, and deathbolt IMO.

Shadow Bolt breaks class fantasy? Whose class fantasy, yours? The original idea was that warlocks use shadow bolts to weaken the enemy until the soul can be drained, as the soul is tethered to the body by life force. Shadow Bolt has always been the core spell for warlocks, especially affliction since destruction got Incinerate in TBC. I stopped playing affliction when it switched to using Malefic Grasp / Drain Soul as filler spell because it just felt too much like a pansy shadow priest’s Mind Flay and not like a WARLOCK’S PEW PEW BOLT OF DEATH. Something has to deal decent crits on demand or it feels empty! Need that satisfying dopamine from anticipating the cast bar filling up and seeing the hit that follows, I guess.
If only Blizzard would let Shadow Bolt scale with Mastery…

Comment by Cronovey

on 2018-06-06T05:48:20-05:00

I main a lock and affliction is too easy to play, there is negligible penalty for moving which is what raises the skill cap for any casting class. I completely understand why they are adding a filler that penalizes you for moving it puts it in line with other casters in my opinion.

Then you are playing it ridiculously wrong… since our dps ST lose is heavy while moving with ideal build. Seems you have lazy build which is FAR from optimal, but that’s your choice, stop ruining affli for others.

Most caster classes lose heavily on ST damage while moving, but the point the other person was trying to make was that affliction is punished much less heavily for it than other caster classes, which is a large imbalance and part of the reason that Affliction has been ridiculously dominant in DPS since Nighthold’s buffs to it. Being punished slightly for having to cancel a channeled drain and move before resuming the drain versus having to cancel a 2.5 second cast when you were already 2.2 seconds into said cast is very different. Affliction loses the damage during the time they were moving only while the other class (say, a fire mage) has now lost 2.2 seconds of damage that the affliction lock was already getting plus the wind-up cast time of their next spell while Affliction is already back to draining, losing bare minimum DPS in comparison.

In addition, Affliction has the option of re-applying DoTs early while in their movement while most other caster specs don’t have this opportunity, resulting in you making up the time slightly later in the fight when you save a GCD a bit later. Compared to a class without a lot of instant cast abilities, this is a very big advantage and part of the reason that they’re bringing back the hard cast Shadowbolt for Affliction instead of making Drain Soul the baseline ability. From an overall balance standpoint it makes a lot more sense; they offer you the choice of taking your Drain Soul back but at the cost of other potential talents and if you choose not to take Drain Soul and grab one of the other talents instead, you’re punished more heavily for movement which means that from a balance standpoint the other talents should probably be tuned to be slightly higher than Drain Soul. Ease of use for slightly lower DPS or more difficult use since you’ll have to plan your positioning better from the start but potentially be provided higher DPS for planning properly.

Comment by MelancholyRose

on 2018-06-06T07:22:14-05:00

What my desire is, I don’t want one spec to be stronger than the other. I don’t want one spec to be objectively stronger in DPS than the others, because that always influences a decision on what spec to play. I love affliction and demo both, but I would love to choose one based on how much fun I have with them, not how much more damage one does over the other.

You might say “no one is stopping you from choosing the spec you wanna play”. No person is, but when you DPS, you want to actually DO DPS. If you’re bottom of the barrel DPS-wise because one spec has less attention than the other or “needs more gear to be useful” I’m going to chuck that spec aside and play the one that does more damage.

Demo had a lot of cast times– in fact, it was mostly cast times. Affliction was almost entirely instant-cast spells plus a channeled drain. Because of this, it was so much stronger in raids where movement is required. I never raided with demo in Legion,and I would have liked to. Before you say “you have a choice, that’s the beauty of it!” In progression raiding? No. You don’t. I don’t just hang out in LFR forever, where whatever it is you do doesn’t matter to either you or anyone else. In progression raiding, the spec you choose actually kind of matters a huge deal.



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